No. it's not for sale. It's also NOT his community to sell. Sure, I suppose he has a right to do it but the ethical implications of selling users by proxy makes me want to vomit in my mouth. Is this what we've come to as a community?!?! Seriously?! This is a douche nozzel move on this part and we are obligated to call him out on it. Period.
beckymccray
· 1 year ago
Though I follow Andrew, I can't say I've developed any sense of being part of "his" community. I agree with Hugh MacLoed's point from SXSW that communities don't belong to us in the first place.
Todd Earwood
· 1 year ago
Since money can't be the issue, my guess is Andrew is bored or we're all apart of some social experiment. Either way, I don't like it and luckily I don't follow him. My guess is his real followers (not the apathetic user or bots) will drop like flies in the next few days.
If you buy into everyone has his/her price... what's yours for your twitter account? What about a pay per tweet like Jason Falls did once for a non-profit? I know you wouldn't sellout, but what's that magic number?
Andrew Baron
· 1 year ago
Nice one Chris, how do you turn this stuff around so fast?
Leon, Im glad I found you here. I wanted to message you on Twitter but of course I couldn't because clearly you dont follow me.
I did want to say that for sure you are taking it the wrong way. This is not how I treat my friends, this is social experiment that came out of a creative moment before I deleted my account.
Dave LaMorte
· 1 year ago
Cha-Ching!
Dr. Wright
· 1 year ago
I think someone will buy it because the weirder it is , the more people want to buy on ebay.
but they probably wont know what to do with it and they will lose followers.
But it begs the questions can you create a twitter starter account? would it be cool to already have 1000 followers on twitter, it might because people dont seem to sure why we care or are following one another.
also, everyone is waiting to see who will monetive twitter first, so they can write a book and sell the information. :)
Albert Maruggi
· 1 year ago
Well this is as transparent as you can get about selling followers, I wonder if they start leaving him and the price tanks.
However, another way that a community or followers have value is if they are motivated to do something by the person they follow. So for example if a person has 1000 followers and invites them to do something, say attend an online event. Let's say 300 of them do it. What would that be worth to the event sponsor, whether that be a charity to whom the 300 people gave money or a company with a new product that just got exposure to 300 people?
So in that regard, there is value to both the Twitterer who is followed, as compensated by their client and value to the followers for being introduced to the charity or product.
Now let's get back to the Baron thing. So what's the difference between that and the Wall Street Journal selling to Murdoch? I mean WSJ has subscribers, followers that pay them. So what's the big deal?
Patrick Sullivan Jr.
· 1 year ago
I'll be honest Chris, I miss Brian Clark. He only writes about 1 out of every 10 new posts. And all the new guys are just so-so rips off of the real deal.
chrisbrogan
· 1 year ago
Albert gets it, I think.
What if Andrew were selling Rocketboom? Would you feel as outraged? And yet, if you're a regular subscriber of Rocketboom, aren't you part of that community?
So what's the difference? Is Twitter more intimate? Why? Because we make it that way?
NOW what are you thinking?
GeekMommy
· 1 year ago
Taking a break from the intellectual property debate on twitter right now to answer this one.
Simply put? No. You can't sell a community. You can sell a brand. You can sell an account. But you can't sell loyalty of others.
If you, Chris Brogan, were to sell your twitter account - I'd quit following that account. It's not the name that's important, it's the value gained from the person behind it.
Just as I stopped reading "Dear Abby" when it stopped being "Abigail Van Buren" and started being her daughter, I would not blindly follow a blog/twitter/whathaveyou just because it was originally founded by someone I admired.
What Baron offered, and what he is selling if he does is an "ACCOUNT" not a community. Communities are made up of people with a reason to have a bond. Accounts are just that.
Adam DesAutels
· 1 year ago
Who knows what will happen. His followers could actually go up because people want to know what will happen. Either way it will be interesting to see the outcome. I hope this doesn’t start a trend in the social networking community or blogging community.
It looks like he already has some bids and nine days to go.
- Adam DesAutels
Jaspal Singh
· 1 year ago
i started following chris a day before .. and i m really happy that i did.
Its worth knowing that what people think .. if you wanna sell your community ..like twitter.
I think the idea is gr..8 if he doesn't want to come back to twitter .. and no point if he is returning back.
sleepwell chris
artifex
· 1 year ago
What makes you think the community hasn't always been for sale? What about a certain streaming video startup, for example, that maybe gave away some phones, and now has people saying come see me streaming live from a bar? This move definitely capitalized on the relationships people have. When you join the next big thing, what will you be asked to do almost as soon as you confirm your email address? Import your contacts so they can be brought in, of course. Selling a twitter account directly just serves to show how much some advertisers will pay to get a single shot at a targeted demographic's attention. (Some of you might be flattered to know how much you could be worth as technical tastemakers, if only you'd stop blogging about making money with blogs)
Mark
· 1 year ago
I feel that communities are not ours to sell -- not unless we've been transparent when making it possible to sign up. It's a breech of trust.
Daisy Olsen
· 1 year ago
This is a very interesting question. The whole idea of blogging bringing voices back to the people comes into question when you consider that blogs could be all eaten up and monopolized by main stream media, corporations, etc. This has happened in so many areas, I wonder if it could also happen here. Of course there is nothing to stop a blogger that sells his from going and starting again, rebuilding an identity and then selling again. I don't think it's something I would endorse but I'm sure it will/does happen.
Albert Maruggi
· 1 year ago
Geek Mommy - et al. I believe that the issue here can be viewed much differently then selling like a piece of property. Now the fact that it is on eBay undermines my position here, but let this idea simmer a bit.
What if a Twitter writer with a committed following said this: Friends, I'm going to take some time away from Twitter, it's a grind yet I realize there is plenty of information to share and perspectives to consider. In my place susie johnson, will submit tweets, direct you to research and even my longer blogs and vidcast that I will still continue to produce.
Please give susie a few weeks and your insights as she continues with similar ideas to mine, but others that I believe you'll find insightful.
What do you think? No good or would you give Susie a chance?
Martin Jamieson
· 1 year ago
I think the value of selling a twitter account will always be pretty marginal. It's so easy to unfollow someone... that creates an enormous risk for the person buying it (even more so if they plan on spamming people with it).
On reflection, selling your blog is one thing because it is the personality of the content on your site that makes the community. A Twitter community is like a rolodex and selling that seems like a local business selling my contact info to marketing agencies.
Scabr
· 1 year ago
NO Followers Sale!NO Twitter Slavery! Creating Twitter Anti-Slavery Alliance.
Adele McAlear
· 1 year ago
I find it interesting that in the first hour after posting the sale to eBay, Andrew's followers have increased by 4.
Selling your account with followers no different than selling an email address to a spammer. I consider it a breech of trust. But unfollowing someone on Twitter is certainly easier than getting your address off the spambots.
@Marketing_Queen commented: "I wouldn't follow him if you paid me. Ummm or is that the next step?" Good point. That could be the next evolution in paid permission marketing. Compensate followers based on how often they are logged into Twitter, pay per click or any number of other ways I'm sure could be created. The account becomes just another broadcast medium hoping to catch a few eyeballs in the Twitterstream.
The mainstreaming of Twitter will see much of this. But, as long as it is easy to unfollow, individuals will always have the choice of what type of communication they want to be exposed to on Twitter.
Greg K
· 1 year ago
Obviously selling a personal Twitter account is a tacky and obnoxious thing to do. But what is it worth? There is a precedent for this on eBay with MySpace accounts.
Here's an example of a MySpace account up for auction on eBay that I just posted on Twitter. It has 28k friends. There are 10 bids so far with the highest bid at $150. http://twurl.nl/zglmhh
MySpace friends are probably less valuable than Twitter friends because there are many spam sites and lots of products sites on MySpace - movies, band, etc that will auto-friend you. So getting high numbers is much easier on MySpace than on Twitter. Even so if a MySpace account with over 25K friends only sells for $150 it is hard to manage any Twitter account being worth much more than that.
Spammers might want to purchase them but it wouldn't take long before people started unsubscribing in droves.
Jack Carlson
· 1 year ago
If someone does buy it, they're not just getting his account and perhaps some of his current followers, but one heck of a well-discussed account. Surely it will draw attention no matter who is providing the content, at least for a short while. Whether it can maintain followers will be interesting to watch.
Christopher S. Penn
· 1 year ago
What are you buying?
In the case of Twitter, you're buying a presence, really.
If Baron put up his Facebook account, that'd be a different story, because I can extract real data from it - names, email addresses, other contact information. At that point, it's a database, and we buy & sell databases all the time. What would I pay for that? The going rate is about $1.50 per valid identity on the commercial markets - you can buy header files from credit bureaus with roughly the same data for about $1.50 a head if you're buying in bulk.
For what it's worth - people are buying and selling your data all the time. Baron's just being transparent about it.
GeekMommy
· 1 year ago
An interesting point Chris... but here's the thing - why buy it from andrew when Suzie can start her own Twitter account and just add people with an endorsement from someone?
I'd be unlikely to follow someone who 'bought' an account or even took one over because I'd be suspicious of his/her motivations - but I'm also not the average twitter user.
It will be interesting to see what happens... but I don't think you can sell community - only access. And honestly? it could hurt the brand/trust of the person selling it - would you trust him the next time he creates an account?
Paul Short
· 1 year ago
I agree somewhat with what's being said above, especially GeekMommy's comments.
I didn't subscribe to or follow Andrew's 'account,' I followed Andrew and what he was saying. Based on that and assuming a buyer would know that a twitter account is more personal than, say, myspace accounts for sale, I'm more interested in what they would expect to get out of owning the account than why Andrew is selling it.
Hans
· 1 year ago
Hi Chris,
this is quite interesting. I'm not offended, we are all trying to make a living and toying around with such things just takes a little bit of courage (but careful, you can burn yourself...), but maybe that's also because I was (yes, WAS) not following him and therefor have no emotional attachment to that twitter account. To me it's exactly as you have said, it's like a telephone number that the wrong person is picking up. I'll definitely be following this (let's not forget that Andrew studied philosophy, maybe this is a little study for him :-) ). Cheers, Hans
So here's the part I find interesting: (And if it's been said above, I'm sorry. It's late and I'm tired. I skimmed and missed it if it was)
So Andrew sells his account for, say, 150.00 and someone pays for a variable number of followers to spread a message to. But what if don't want the account? What if I'd rather pay Andrew 5.00 to talk about me or my brand 3 times. I don't retain control, and this don't "destroy" his community - it's all still there and in his hands.
Could PayPerPost's April Fool's PayPerTweet prank not be far off?
fallenrogue
· 1 year ago
@andrew baron. If I'm taking it the wrong way then perhaps you are presenting your context in the wrong way. I read the comments above and all I see is a giant semantics argument that doesn't have the collective gall to call an idea out as terrible. Experiment? To what end? What's your hypothisis? That your followers and fans can be bought and sold?! Who does that? What human with any sense of honor and dignity does that? Sure I'm upset by your so called experiment!!! I'm outraged by it.
@chris not all "experiments" are harmless. Not everything in the "social space" is the same. Is twitter more intimate? I don't know but selling off the people who follow you in earnest without their consent is unethical. You don't need an "experiment" to know what we've know for years. Calling it is an experiment is a cop out. It's selling out your user base to the highest bidder and it's as command place in today's market as twitter. I simply expected more from our community leaders. Yes rocketboom was a leader in online content and I expect more. I'm hurt and disappointed. Again, just my 2 cents which I assume is all my opinion is worth on ebay anyway.
Steve "Snowball" Saylor
· 1 year ago
I do agree with some sentiments that yes, selling a Twitter account is not neccessarily a community. It, more or less, is a community following one person. I also agree with Chris Penn, if this was Facebook, there is some very important information that can be gleamed from Facebook that Twitter you can't. What are you really getting with Twitter? You get a list of online presences that followed Andrew. There really isn't anything to really gain from that other than now a large group of people to talk to, that the potential buyer may not have had, or can.
Now if the sale goes through, that person, will now have the Twitter presence formally known as Andrew Baron. The buyer is now the facade of Andrew. We technically have the same thing with Fake Steve Jobs. Unless the buyer uses the twitter account as Fake Andrew Baron, who knows that may work, that may not. It certainly did for Daniel Lyons. The only difference between the two is that one online presence is bought the other isn't.
It's a neat experiment. Kind of shady, but a neat thing to see what happens.
Laura "Pistachio" Fitton
· 1 year ago
I love that this all stirred up discussion of what would happen if this were serious. My gut tells me it's not. Then again my gut is wrong plenty of times.
@tommyvallier in dark moments, i hope PayPerTweet is NOT far off. don't shoot me. i am NOT taking money to tweet stuff, but I AM AMAZED how many times a day i am asked to tweet things for others. just amazed.
there is a lot yet to be determined about valuing "audience" (i'd rather call them "participants" frankly) across ALL social media platforms.
i love Twitter and invest a lot of time there for the community, intellectual stimulation and support it gives me. i have also DEFINITELY gotten clients through it, just via old fashioned networking. for me it works.
but compared with investing that time in a blog, which *could* host ads if it caught on, the average (not a consultant) microblogger has little direct economic incentive to produce quality content. not saying that's what matters at Twitter. if you know me there, you KNOW that's not what matters to me.
BUT.
i'm just pointing it out. there are more questions here than answers.
I'd be very concerned if I've ever sent him a direct message and it's still there in his account. They're private messages for a reason, after all.
Other than that, I frankly don't care one way or another about his attempt to sell the account, since he's being transparent about the whole deal. I'd probably be a bit peeved if it weren't Andrew anymore but he didn't tell people. But even then, I still have the power to walk away so imho, it's no big deal.
I'd probably still want to keep the original Twitter account name by creating a new one after renaming the old one, since people know it and will probably continue to look for it.
David Jacobs
· 1 year ago
Andrew certainly has the right to sell his account and others have a right to stop following. I think what really matters is what you're buying. You are buying Andrew's audience as would be the same with any other media property. Did I just say Twitter is a media property? In this case, yes. The buyer had better understand the audience and the reasons they follow Andrew. If they can deliver something that matches that need, than it's a good deal for everybody. If they do not, people will leave and it's a big waste of money. You can buy a mailing list too, but shotgunning content and promotion to that list is very old marketing thinking. I hope people don't fall into the same old marketing tricks using new technology. There are new dynamics at work here and the old tricks won't work. It's still about engagement and trust and the conversation. There is no inherent value in buying a Twitter account with 1,000 followers in it.
Brian
· 1 year ago
I'm curious what this will do to Andrew's reputation. If any of those Twitter followers are "fans" of his work hoping to stay up to date with what he is doing, there is a decent chance they will feel betrayed by this.
If he starts a new project like Rocketboom, it will have a heightened probability for success because he has exposure and reputation. This move could potentially ruin the latter, but he will still have more exposure than he did when he launched Rocketboom.
He can do what he wants with/to his reputation, but he is gambling with the personal brand equity he accumulated through Rocketboom.
Whitney
· 1 year ago
I assume this is Andrew's personal account. If it were Rocketboom's, a competitor could buy it and use it to malign the company's reputation; frankly, anyone buying a twitter account could do the same thing- which is why it may be important, like with domain names, to register yourself on certain social networks, before someone takes your name and uses it for purposes other than which you intend. Imagine someone grabbing Robert Scoble's name on Mahalo, for example, and posting their information as his.....it could happen.
So we all have to agree that there is a general social norm or contract that we are who we are online and offline- hopefully the same person. Not everyone abides by this rule (and it's why I find second life so confusing- relearning who I already know with different names and clothing...) Otherwise, it will be hard to forge online relationships that carryover to any trust relationship offline.
Rachael Hampton
· 1 year ago
Wow a social experiment that has turn into lots of bad feedback or shall I say an "experiment on social ethics".
People aren't for sell, also this lead me to believe it was all about money in the first place.
I think his brand equity is going down.
Mark O'Neill
· 1 year ago
When people realise it's not Andrew Baron on the other end, the value of that Twitter account plummets! People then unfollow him and that's that.
In fact, now that the news is out, I get the feeling that his Twitter account will already be toast. No-one likes to be seen as a commodity to be bought and sold. I certainly don't.
Martin Jamieson
· 1 year ago
...on a related note - do we need to worry about less scrupulous marketers hacking - or - tweet jacking - our accounts?
I also agree with "mdy"'s comment - what if Baron has private messages in his account and he then passes the account with those private messages to the new owner? Wouldn't it be a breach of trust to the person who sent those private messages in the first place?
Baron should at the very least give a public promise that all private messages will be deleted.
Adele McAlear
· 1 year ago
For those of you concerned about DMs on Twitter not being confidential if the account is sold, they are not like email; they are messages with shared custody. If you delete a message from your "Sent" tab, it ALSO gets deleted from the recipient's "Inbox" tab, and vice versa. It's good to have control over your DMs, but it also means that if there's one YOU want to save, it could be deleted by the other party at any time.
Brett Nordquist
· 1 year ago
I don't follow Andrew on Twitter but if I did, I'd unfollow him. Won't others follow suit until most of his followers are gone? It's just too easy to leave him. Anyone who's on Twitter know how easy it is to just leave him and move on to the next idiot. It reminds me of those kids who purchase high level accounts on World of Warcraft yet have no idea how their character works so they look dumb.
Taco John
· 1 year ago
A slightly related note would be how far away we are from Twitter squatting. Once the primary is over, should I go register @obama2012 or @clinton2012? Can I register @saturn and wait for GM to starting twittering to rake in a couple grand? Is this happening already?
Ian
· 1 year ago
It's the same as a marketing company selling a mailing list, except to just one person. Every follower is in effect a subscriber to the mailing list.
Richard Hay
· 1 year ago
This reminds me a bit of people in Second Life, World of Warcraft, etc. creating accounts and either selling off things they have earned in the game via eBay or creating starter accounts to get to a certain level and then hand it over.
fallenrogue
· 1 year ago
ok. I decided to channel my outrage on my blog rather than continue to bore anyone unwillingly here. If you're interested: http://is.gd/5NI
Michael | University Scholar
· 1 year ago
He is smart for selling it. It is the person buying it that is not smart.
Clintus McGintus
· 1 year ago
I'm curious how it all pans out. I'm sure some will unfollow as soon as the auction is over if they haven't already. Others will stick around to see how the new owner uses the account. Aside from all of the hype of the sale, I'm sand that Andrew no longer wishes to use Twitter for personnel use. I love following friends and people I'm interested in. So the fact that he is leaving all together is the part that bothers me. But I still have him in other places. We'll see.
Preston
· 1 year ago
You buy/sell news. You buy/sell information. You buy/sell brands. You buy/sell websites.
You CAN'T buy/sell personality.
Cyndee Haydon
· 1 year ago
I thought this was a joke when you posted on Twitter - I am curious to see what happens because to me it's nothing without him - people are following and communicating with "him" - lurking to see what happens. And if you bought it - what's it worth if everyone quits following?
Mary-Lynn
· 1 year ago
No cuddling, no love. Just let me follow you, and then sell me. I feel so used...
Eric Susch
· 1 year ago
I don't get why some people are so upset by what Andrew is doing. I'm one of his followers and I know him personally. I'm not being "sold." I have not lost control of myself. I can un-follow at any time. Communities self-correct themselves. If something changes the main value of the community, people just leave and go someplace else.
I think the only thing Andrew is going to prove is that some people will pay a lot of money for something that will be totally worthless.
the constant skeptic
· 1 year ago
I am #skeptical of loren feldman, but his ebay bid for his twitter account is now up to 1125 USD. @EricSusch I I agree that people will pay a lot of money for something that is worthless.
I think what is more interesting is that maybe he is proving that rich entrepreneurs who do not know twitter or what it is about will get misled into thinking they are buying something of value. This may be the beginning of the next web bubble bursting, just very slowly.
M_Barger
· 1 year ago
Perhaps the point that Andrew is making...
We have a great thing going on here - SM, the voice of the people, communincation, etc. But as you mention, what happens when that communication is sold to another company? Certainly the purchaser will have intents/goals that differ from the sellers - the overall message would change.
Chris, your theory has a good deal of potential, but when that happens aren't we "cattle" again? If the buyers also buy the pen names as well, only the acutely attuned may have any insight to such a change.
This could eventually lead to the resurgence of oneway communications (advertising) that make most consumers cynical, morose and apathetic towards brands.
Matt Bowman
· 1 year ago
Welcome to the credibility market. Develope a reputation then sell it to spammers. Editorial prostitution.
Being part of something, even a blogging community, makes it much more personal. Meaning, if a blog were sold to another entity then most persons of that community feel a sense of betrayal and will look for another community in whcich to be a part of.
I don't call this social media. I call it an irrational love of Ebay. Are they paying for this kind of advertising? Or, how much Ebay stock does Andrew own?
Take care.
Tony Katz
Rick Mahn
· 1 year ago
Interesting... Assuming that he is serious and it is for sale - how does Hugh MacLeod's deleting of his own Twitter account affect the value of Andrew's account?
Honestly, assuming that there is some monetary value attached to a Twitter account of a well known person, wouldn't Hugh's action last week degrade the value of Andrew's?
Of course, in my book a Twitter account in the name of an individual has no monetary worth. It has value to me if it's the actual person using it to share and interact with the community. If Andrew (or Scoble, Brogan, Rubel, Winer) were to sell their Twitter account and another person started to post using it - I'd drop it immediately. I'm interested in the thoughts and interactions of the people I follow, not the name that it's posted under.
Like I said though, interesting...
Leif Hansen
· 1 year ago
Predictions:
Scenario #1 After this fascinating experiment goes viral, Andrew will change his mind at the last minute, smile, and enjoy the increase in followers, publicity and more.
Scenario #2 Andrew gets a surprising chunk from ebay; the buyer gets a short boost of hits and then a gradual drop-off of twitter followers (the ones that would be of value); Andrew is relieved from the burden of a tool he wasn't using and enjoying; a mass of new twitter accounts are created by those with copy-cat ideas; @HilaryClinton sells her account to Obama for...oh wait, she's only got 3k followers to his 23k...well, he still buys it cause he's nice.
Kudos for getting people thinking about many key questions here Andrew (whether or not you thought it would bring up so many questions about community, value, etc.)
My 2 cents. I just didn't like the way he framed it in his eBay posting. He states that he's selling his following of over 1,000 people. To me, that shows that he wasn't interested in using Twitter to connect to people but to build up another audience willing to consume his content. While there is room for that on Twitter, I don't see it transferring well through just some random eBay auction.
He does have a disclaimer at the bottom that people may unfollow but his intention to sell his followers seems shallow.
Edoardo
· 1 year ago
He is not selling friends, he is selling an account and not sensible informations.
People sells businesses everyday, a friend of mine is selling his Bar, that doesn't mean he is selling his usual guests as well (even though this represent a value in the beginning).
Think about people working in a big company, happens everyday and we say "we got sold" even if it is not like that, we know we can find another job if we don't like the new owners.
So a twitter account is a business? yes, you don't get money directly from it but if you twitt smart you may end up having 1500 followers that you can influent about something (or not) and this is a possibility that could lead you to make some money out of it.
Do I like it? personally no, as I don't like people selling and buying databases, bad shows on tv, etc. etc.
Marco
· 1 year ago
you are DEAD on.
One of the most fascinating things to me is the growing fluidity of the web's current landscape and the challenges it will continue to create for existing and emerging businesses alike.
The gradual erosion of brand loyalty is an amazing thing to watch - Google is destroying the search market right now but if a more powerful search engine with an equal or better interface landed tomorrow who WOULDN'T jump ship in a heartbeat?
That said the delay in adoption rates will serve as a bottleneck to extreme instability. I wouldn't classify myself as an early adopter but I eagerly follow those of you who are and it has been a real eye opener. It has been interesting to see how some of you who exist at the center of these new web developments have already tired of Facebook's weaknesses and moved on while everyone else is still very much overwhelmed by the myriad of options.
These dynamics will serve those who purchase "communities" or blogs well since I imho it will mean that - while aggressive users will likely bail and follow the other members of their particular community - everyone else will just be learning about a popular site or product and file in (or remain)...for a time.
All Comments
If you buy into everyone has his/her price... what's yours for your twitter account? What about a pay per tweet like Jason Falls did once for a non-profit? I know you wouldn't sellout, but what's that magic number?
Leon, Im glad I found you here. I wanted to message you on Twitter but of course I couldn't because clearly you dont follow me.
I did want to say that for sure you are taking it the wrong way. This is not how I treat my friends, this is social experiment that came out of a creative moment before I deleted my account.
but they probably wont know what to do with it and they will lose followers.
But it begs the questions can you create a twitter starter account? would it be cool to already have 1000 followers on twitter, it might because people dont seem to sure why we care or are following one another.
also, everyone is waiting to see who will monetive twitter first, so they can write a book and sell the information.
:)
However, another way that a community or followers have value is if they are motivated to do something by the person they follow. So for example if a person has 1000 followers and invites them to do something, say attend an online event. Let's say 300 of them do it. What would that be worth to the event sponsor, whether that be a charity to whom the 300 people gave money or a company with a new product that just got exposure to 300 people?
So in that regard, there is value to both the Twitterer who is followed, as compensated by their client and value to the followers for being introduced to the charity or product.
Now let's get back to the Baron thing. So what's the difference between that and the Wall Street Journal selling to Murdoch? I mean WSJ has subscribers, followers that pay them. So what's the big deal?
What if Andrew were selling Rocketboom? Would you feel as outraged? And yet, if you're a regular subscriber of Rocketboom, aren't you part of that community?
So what's the difference? Is Twitter more intimate? Why? Because we make it that way?
NOW what are you thinking?
Simply put? No. You can't sell a community.
You can sell a brand. You can sell an account.
But you can't sell loyalty of others.
If you, Chris Brogan, were to sell your twitter account - I'd quit following that account.
It's not the name that's important, it's the value gained from the person behind it.
Just as I stopped reading "Dear Abby" when it stopped being "Abigail Van Buren" and started being her daughter, I would not blindly follow a blog/twitter/whathaveyou just because it was originally founded by someone I admired.
What Baron offered, and what he is selling if he does is an "ACCOUNT" not a community. Communities are made up of people with a reason to have a bond. Accounts are just that.
It looks like he already has some bids and nine days to go.
- Adam DesAutels
Its worth knowing that what people think .. if you wanna sell your community ..like twitter.
I think the idea is gr..8 if he doesn't want to come back to twitter .. and no point if he is returning back.
sleepwell chris
What if a Twitter writer with a committed following said this: Friends, I'm going to take some time away from Twitter, it's a grind yet I realize there is plenty of information to share and perspectives to consider. In my place susie johnson, will submit tweets, direct you to research and even my longer blogs and vidcast that I will still continue to produce.
Please give susie a few weeks and your insights as she continues with similar ideas to mine, but others that I believe you'll find insightful.
What do you think? No good or would you give Susie a chance?
@martyj
Selling your account with followers no different than selling an email address to a spammer. I consider it a breech of trust. But unfollowing someone on Twitter is certainly easier than getting your address off the spambots.
@Marketing_Queen commented: "I wouldn't follow him if you paid me. Ummm or is that the next step?" Good point. That could be the next evolution in paid permission marketing. Compensate followers based on how often they are logged into Twitter, pay per click or any number of other ways I'm sure could be created. The account becomes just another broadcast medium hoping to catch a few eyeballs in the Twitterstream.
The mainstreaming of Twitter will see much of this. But, as long as it is easy to unfollow, individuals will always have the choice of what type of communication they want to be exposed to on Twitter.
Here's an example of a MySpace account up for auction on eBay that I just posted on Twitter. It has 28k friends. There are 10 bids so far with the highest bid at $150. http://twurl.nl/zglmhh
MySpace friends are probably less valuable than Twitter friends because there are many spam sites and lots of products sites on MySpace - movies, band, etc that will auto-friend you. So getting high numbers is much easier on MySpace than on Twitter. Even so if a MySpace account with over 25K friends only sells for $150 it is hard to manage any Twitter account being worth much more than that.
Spammers might want to purchase them but it wouldn't take long before people started unsubscribing in droves.
In the case of Twitter, you're buying a presence, really.
If Baron put up his Facebook account, that'd be a different story, because I can extract real data from it - names, email addresses, other contact information. At that point, it's a database, and we buy & sell databases all the time. What would I pay for that? The going rate is about $1.50 per valid identity on the commercial markets - you can buy header files from credit bureaus with roughly the same data for about $1.50 a head if you're buying in bulk.
For what it's worth - people are buying and selling your data all the time. Baron's just being transparent about it.
I'd be unlikely to follow someone who 'bought' an account or even took one over because I'd be suspicious of his/her motivations - but I'm also not the average twitter user.
It will be interesting to see what happens... but I don't think you can sell community - only access.
And honestly? it could hurt the brand/trust of the person selling it - would you trust him the next time he creates an account?
I didn't subscribe to or follow Andrew's 'account,' I followed Andrew and what he was saying. Based on that and assuming a buyer would know that a twitter account is more personal than, say, myspace accounts for sale, I'm more interested in what they would expect to get out of owning the account than why Andrew is selling it.
this is quite interesting. I'm not offended, we are all trying to make a living and toying around with such things just takes a little bit of courage (but careful, you can burn yourself...), but maybe that's also because I was (yes, WAS) not following him and therefor have no emotional attachment to that twitter account. To me it's exactly as you have said, it's like a telephone number that the wrong person is picking up.
I'll definitely be following this (let's not forget that Andrew studied philosophy, maybe this is a little study for him :-) ).
Cheers, Hans
So Andrew sells his account for, say, 150.00 and someone pays for a variable number of followers to spread a message to. But what if don't want the account? What if I'd rather pay Andrew 5.00 to talk about me or my brand 3 times. I don't retain control, and this don't "destroy" his community - it's all still there and in his hands.
Could PayPerPost's April Fool's PayPerTweet prank not be far off?
@chris not all "experiments" are harmless. Not everything in the "social space" is the same. Is twitter more intimate? I don't know but selling off the people who follow you in earnest without their consent is unethical. You don't need an "experiment" to know what we've know for years. Calling it is an experiment is a cop out. It's selling out your user base to the highest bidder and it's as command place in today's market as twitter. I simply expected more from our community leaders. Yes rocketboom was a leader in online content and I expect more. I'm hurt and disappointed. Again, just my 2 cents which I assume is all my opinion is worth on ebay anyway.
Now if the sale goes through, that person, will now have the Twitter presence formally known as Andrew Baron. The buyer is now the facade of Andrew. We technically have the same thing with Fake Steve Jobs. Unless the buyer uses the twitter account as Fake Andrew Baron, who knows that may work, that may not. It certainly did for Daniel Lyons. The only difference between the two is that one online presence is bought the other isn't.
It's a neat experiment. Kind of shady, but a neat thing to see what happens.
@tommyvallier in dark moments, i hope PayPerTweet is NOT far off. don't shoot me. i am NOT taking money to tweet stuff, but I AM AMAZED how many times a day i am asked to tweet things for others. just amazed.
there is a lot yet to be determined about valuing "audience" (i'd rather call them "participants" frankly) across ALL social media platforms.
i love Twitter and invest a lot of time there for the community, intellectual stimulation and support it gives me. i have also DEFINITELY gotten clients through it, just via old fashioned networking. for me it works.
but compared with investing that time in a blog, which *could* host ads if it caught on, the average (not a consultant) microblogger has little direct economic incentive to produce quality content. not saying that's what matters at Twitter. if you know me there, you KNOW that's not what matters to me.
BUT.
i'm just pointing it out. there are more questions here than answers.
Other than that, I frankly don't care one way or another about his attempt to sell the account, since he's being transparent about the whole deal. I'd probably be a bit peeved if it weren't Andrew anymore but he didn't tell people. But even then, I still have the power to walk away so imho, it's no big deal.
I'd probably still want to keep the original Twitter account name by creating a new one after renaming the old one, since people know it and will probably continue to look for it.
If he starts a new project like Rocketboom, it will have a heightened probability for success because he has exposure and reputation. This move could potentially ruin the latter, but he will still have more exposure than he did when he launched Rocketboom.
He can do what he wants with/to his reputation, but he is gambling with the personal brand equity he accumulated through Rocketboom.
So we all have to agree that there is a general social norm or contract that we are who we are online and offline- hopefully the same person. Not everyone abides by this rule (and it's why I find second life so confusing- relearning who I already know with different names and clothing...) Otherwise, it will be hard to forge online relationships that carryover to any trust relationship offline.
People aren't for sell, also this lead me to believe it was all about money in the first place.
I think his brand equity is going down.
In fact, now that the news is out, I get the feeling that his Twitter account will already be toast. No-one likes to be seen as a commodity to be bought and sold. I certainly don't.
Think about how many new twitter tools have come out lately, and how many ask you for your twitter password?
http://marketing-seo.com/twitter/tweet-jacking....
Baron should at the very least give a public promise that all private messages will be deleted.
You buy/sell information.
You buy/sell brands.
You buy/sell websites.
You CAN'T buy/sell personality.
I think the only thing Andrew is going to prove is that some people will pay a lot of money for something that will be totally worthless.
I think what is more interesting is that maybe he is proving that rich entrepreneurs who do not know twitter or what it is about will get misled into thinking they are buying something of value. This may be the beginning of the next web bubble bursting, just very slowly.
We have a great thing going on here - SM, the voice of the people, communincation, etc. But as you mention, what happens when that communication is sold to another company? Certainly the purchaser will have intents/goals that differ from the sellers - the overall message would change.
Chris, your theory has a good deal of potential, but when that happens aren't we "cattle" again? If the buyers also buy the pen names as well, only the acutely attuned may have any insight to such a change.
This could eventually lead to the resurgence of oneway communications (advertising) that make most consumers cynical, morose and apathetic towards brands.
More thoughts here: http://alwayson.goingon.com/permalink/post/26367
Being part of something, even a blogging community, makes it much more personal. Meaning, if a blog were sold to another entity then most persons of that community feel a sense of betrayal and will look for another community in whcich to be a part of.
This isn't about community, its about publicity. About a year ago, they decided to sell their Vloggie award (http://rocketboom.wikia.com/wiki/Vloggie).
Before that, is was advertising for sale (http://digg.com/tech_news/Rocketboom_to_Sell_Ad...)).
I don't call this social media. I call it an irrational love of Ebay. Are they paying for this kind of advertising? Or, how much Ebay stock does Andrew own?
Take care.
Tony Katz
Honestly, assuming that there is some monetary value attached to a Twitter account of a well known person, wouldn't Hugh's action last week degrade the value of Andrew's?
Of course, in my book a Twitter account in the name of an individual has no monetary worth. It has value to me if it's the actual person using it to share and interact with the community. If Andrew (or Scoble, Brogan, Rubel, Winer) were to sell their Twitter account and another person started to post using it - I'd drop it immediately. I'm interested in the thoughts and interactions of the people I follow, not the name that it's posted under.
Like I said though, interesting...
Scenario #1 After this fascinating experiment goes viral, Andrew will change his mind at the last minute, smile, and enjoy the increase in followers, publicity and more.
Scenario #2 Andrew gets a surprising chunk from ebay; the buyer gets a short boost of hits and then a gradual drop-off of twitter followers (the ones that would be of value); Andrew is relieved from the burden of a tool he wasn't using and enjoying; a mass of new twitter accounts are created by those with copy-cat ideas; @HilaryClinton sells her account to Obama for...oh wait, she's only got 3k followers to his 23k...well, he still buys it cause he's nice.
Kudos for getting people thinking about many key questions here Andrew (whether or not you thought it would bring up so many questions about community, value, etc.)
-Leif
www.SparkSocialMedia.com
To me, that shows that he wasn't interested in using Twitter to connect to people but to build up another audience willing to consume his content. While there is room for that on Twitter, I don't see it transferring well through just some random eBay auction.
He does have a disclaimer at the bottom that people may unfollow but his intention to sell his followers seems shallow.
People sells businesses everyday, a friend of mine is selling his Bar, that doesn't mean he is selling his usual guests as well (even though this represent a value in the beginning).
Think about people working in a big company, happens everyday and we say "we got sold" even if it is not like that, we know we can find another job if we don't like the new owners.
So a twitter account is a business? yes, you don't get money directly from it but if you twitt smart you may end up having 1500 followers that you can influent about something (or not) and this is a possibility that could lead you to make some money out of it.
Do I like it? personally no, as I don't like people selling and buying databases, bad shows on tv, etc. etc.
One of the most fascinating things to me is the growing fluidity of the web's current landscape and the challenges it will continue to create for existing and emerging businesses alike.
The gradual erosion of brand loyalty is an amazing thing to watch - Google is destroying the search market right now but if a more powerful search engine with an equal or better interface landed tomorrow who WOULDN'T jump ship in a heartbeat?
That said the delay in adoption rates will serve as a bottleneck to extreme instability. I wouldn't classify myself as an early adopter but I eagerly follow those of you who are and it has been a real eye opener. It has been interesting to see how some of you who exist at the center of these new web developments have already tired of Facebook's weaknesses and moved on while everyone else is still very much overwhelmed by the myriad of options.
These dynamics will serve those who purchase "communities" or blogs well since I imho it will mean that - while aggressive users will likely bail and follow the other members of their particular community - everyone else will just be learning about a popular site or product and file in (or remain)...for a time.