Chris, I appreciate your first post, because it was human, and really didn't have anything to do with celebrity - and then this one for the same reason. You're practicing what you're preaching.
What a relief,
Steve Elmore, VT
Donagh Mc Sweeney
· 5 months ago
I would have to agree with steve.
Hope you don't mind a trackback.
Donagh McSweeney, Loopthing
Chris Brogan
· 5 months ago
Where's Elmore, VT compared to say, Smuggler's Notch? I was there 2 weeks ago.
Karen Boushie
· 5 months ago
Hey Chris, Karen from Smugglers' Notch Resort PR here. Re Elmore, it's about 40-45 minutes east of here and home to Lake Elmore, a great little state park, and near Elmore Roots Nursery--awesome organic jam (you can't beat the Pear Raspberry or VT Blueberry). That's my little VT products plug for the day!
Appreciate your social media insights. It's a fun new world.
Chris Brogan
· 5 months ago
Hiya Karen--
Thanks for the feedback. You know, it *might* be that I'm heading up your way again in the fall. Was talking to Steve Wright over at Jay Peak about it.
It's an educational opportunity, and/or maybe we'll just get a chance to say howdy do.
Thanks for the update about Elmore. : )
--Chris...
Karen Boushie
· 5 months ago
Sounds great--hope it works out for another visit. Take care. --Karen
alkrueger
· 5 months ago
Great post. It looks like our friend Danny Brown has influenced you. Well played. I dig your comments up-top. I get a surprising amount of pitches for the Comet Branding Blog and Radio show. In all honesty, I never expected to get any. In a way it's kind of cool - in another way it's just not. For the pitches I receive, less than one in 10 actually have my name in the email. [It makes a difference. It really does.] One in 15 actually state [if only vaguely] why they've spent their time sending an email to me in the first place [I want you to put so and so on your radio show with this topic]. Less than one in 25 are relevant to what we cover. In the end, we've only acted on four or five really solid pitches. Because of this experience, the pitching that I do for clients has improved as well. I think everyone should be required to get pitched 100 times before they can pitch to others. I think it would change the world by reducing garbage pitches and improving the quality of stories that are written/told as a result. Stay rad Chris. Stay rad.
Ed
· 5 months ago
This is a copy & paste of the comment I just left at Seth's post: http://is.gd/1xRAt
Why-(especially my last ΒΆ), I agree with Chris' frustration in post 1
This was my MO forever. It still is- to a degree. I offer a taste of feedback that someone with a desire for deeper understanding will recognize. But- it is nearly always a waste of precious time. Irretrievable time. I put it out there, those who care can come to me.
Reality: If someone is willing to buy a list and spam on the fly with a half-assed blast, they are very unlikely to heed wise counsel.
Sure, everyone needs a job on the way up, and one action may not define the person. But people who want to operate with integrity and vision are usually lucid, quality individuals who will not put their name on garbage.
The real problem: That unsolicited email (with or without typos), screams "We're willing to interrupt you out of nowhere for OUR benefit. What's best for you couldn't mean less!!"
judyreywasserman
· 5 months ago
Yeah Chris! What you wrote is how to influence me too. Probably anyone. And since we all need or want to influence someone, it';s good advice to remember. As always, TY!
Judy Rey On Twitter: @judyrey
Danny Brown
· 5 months ago
Hey there Chris,
First, kudos for writing such a quick and info-led reply (I wasn't expecting anything until tomorrow!!) :)
My initial comment wasn't meant to chide (or sound like it) - I was more trying to gauge one view over the other (the email's constructiveness over the post's criticism).
I agree that crappy pitches will always be crappy pitches, and some just go off the scale with fill on crapola levels. Some you ignore, some you try and deal with. As you mentioned when chatting on Twitter (and on Seth Simonds's blog post), it's not worth the personal effort to educate/help the one as opposed to the many, hence the post.
I still think Seth makes a good point on his post, but I can also see why the time factor involved (if you did it with everyone) would be too consuming.
I think it can be a mix of both. Sometimes, it's worth that little bit of time to reach out to the emailer in question (unless it's so typically a mass mailer) and ask them a bit about their approach and offer a little guidance about you being a match for their needs. If they don't listen then, that could be an opportunity to share lessons learned (or not) with others?
The funny thing is, the two separate posts now combined show both how not to pitch and an almost best practice for any company pitching the "new world" of influential bloggers to test products or services.
Still wondering when/if SoBe will get involved.... ;-)
Thanks for this post, Chris.
drmani
· 5 months ago
As someone who has built his entire web presence through relationship marketing that comes from the heart, I completely endorse the important point you are making, Chris. Yes, permission based marketing isn't quick or easy - but as you said, it's not about the 'numbers', but about 'impact' and 'influence' and 'attention'.
Is it 'wasteful' of time to do things this way? Maybe. If you think a farmer 'wastes' seeds by planting so many, when only a few will grow. But then, if the alternative is to plant only a handful, or worse, pick the cheapest seeds (of poorer quality) just because of a promise of 'quick yield', then you'd end up with a lot of wasteland - the way so many 'shot-gun' marketers are headed!
Your message will resonate with a tiny fraction of your audience. But I'm willing to bet that, if we took a poll in 2015, that tiny segment will be the ONLY one that's still around, successful and thriving.
All success Dr.Mani
Chris Brogan
· 5 months ago
You're the MODEL for this, Dr. Mani. You know that the human touch is EVERYTHING on the web. Glad you weighed in, my friend.
deanholmes
· 5 months ago
Dr. Mani,
Great comment here. As a disciple of relationship marketing, having the know-how and ability to articulate the complex relationship to the simple conversion is key.
As I talk with CEO's, CMO's and many senior leadership teams on strategy, one thing is clearly missing in their thought process - relationship. Many have not figured out a way to tie sentiment, behavior and profiles to their current valuable customers and make that connection.
The sooner Marketers understand this concept (and many will painfully get it by doing nothing) the sooner we can all have a stronger user experience.
sethsimonds
· 5 months ago
re: inserting names to "personalize"...do you see that as the midpoint between highly targeted personal pitches and ostensibly scalable blast emails?
It seems like [insert first name here] emails have already gone the way of the dodo insofar as effectiveness goes.
Thanks for the quick response, both to Danny's question and my follow-up post. You're a role model for real-time interaction.
marjae
· 5 months ago
Great follow up! I have really enjoyed your initial post, Seth Simonds' post, Danny's comments (both on here and on twitter), and this amazing follow-up blog post. Many thanks for the great learning experience!
On the other hand... maybe this wasn't the smartest thing to do? Now we'll all know how to create and send a perfect, customized, "according-to-Brogan" pitch. Would you have the heart to turn one down? :)
Marja Ernst
PS. Chris, I really love the fact admit and emphasize the fact you could be wrong. I deeply respect that in people. Kudos to you.
Chris Brogan
· 5 months ago
Thanks, Marja. That's either human, or it's proof that I'm often wrong. : )
Alexandra Levit
· 5 months ago
Chris, if every high-profile influencer was as honest and helpful as you are, there wouldn't be as many bad pitches in the world.
Chris Brogan
· 5 months ago
Kind words, Alexandra. Know what's funny? A recurring conversation I have with my business partner, @ssaber, goes like this: "Man, only assholes win. Doesn't that stink?" Him: "yep, but I've yet to see the exception to the rule, depending on what you consider a win." Me: ...
So yeah, I'll just be who I am and see if I can break the chain.
georgeegonut
· 5 months ago
You're right on. Why don't marketers realize that if they broadcast to someone that they're trying to influence that they could care less about doing their personal research and just want to know what you can do for them (while spending as little time as possible to do it) they their messages are (at best) going right into the trash? Hopefully this may help some realize that not only is it ineffective, the potential for being called out publicly is quite real.
Also, I second the "bull." If the person you're contacting isn't worth the time, why do you think they'll feel that you are?
DeeJay_NYC
· 5 months ago
RE: "We've ALL got megaphones." These days, all transactions (money-centered or not) are based on whether people "Know, Like and Trust" whomever is on the other side of that transaction. So, here's a thought: What happened to old school marketing? Social Media KLT it!
KLT = Know, Like and Trust.
Chris, how 'bout holding a little contest for who can come up with the best string of KLT-containing phrases or sentences? Could be fun! What do you think?
Loved your post, Peace and Love, DeeJay
Chris Brogan
· 5 months ago
Can you give me an example of one?
DeeJay_NYC
· 5 months ago
Sorry, Chris, I guess I didn't display it well before. How's this:
Question: What ever happened to old school marketing? Answer: Social Media KLT it! (as in: Social Media's KLT formula/philosophy killed it!)
Peace and Love, DeeJay
DeeJay_NYC
· 5 months ago
Or how 'bout this:
Question: How do you recognized a social media transaction? Answer: It'll be wearing a KLT!
OK. ... guess this is too convoluted to fly, huh?
Oh well... bttdb (back to the drawing board)!
P&L to ya, Chris, Deejay
mnphysicist
· 5 months ago
I think trying to quantify influence via numbers, even comments, technoratie is an iffy deal... There are so many intangibles. The thing is, in the process of identifying the true influencers, more than likely, you will uncover some key human aspects, be there before the sale, targeting, and the amount of verbosity or lack thereof needed.
In the old days, this was doing your homework before the meeting. Why should online be any different? Sure, one can accomplish many more virtual interactions in the same time one could do a single 3d meeting... but shot gunning dilutes ones effort mult-ifold, and thereby lessens the probability of success, even if you try to scale it... and in time, I just don't think see that working out too well.
Shira Abel
· 5 months ago
Alright - I have to admit this left me a little bent. Not because I disagree with it, I don't - but because I've done ALL OF THIS with another blog that I would like to have a link exchange with (it's a biggy). I've followed them on twitter. I've RT'd comments and I've responded to posts. I've commented on the blog. I've followed directions for a link exchange. I emailed - and have had all of my emails ignored (*which I only send every few months.) So then what?
deanholmes
· 5 months ago
Chris (Got the 3rd suggestion right - first name)
(I will be brief - suggestions 2) I have said this a few times both here in other posts at http://chrisbrogan.com, so it bears saying again. Relationships, (Influence) begins with understanding your audience (Profiling) and you wont have to worry about the numbers - crowds will come.
Once you attract your audience, make sure you covet them like never before - or else, they will leave you quicker than ever (Suggestion 5).
Thanks (I said I would be brief)
Dean
Chris Brogan
· 5 months ago
Thanks, Dean. I love the parenthetical walkthrough! Great implementation.
deanholmes
· 5 months ago
Chris, thanks for the reply. Always insightful and there's no wonder why we all stay tight to your posts and the comments you get are truly amazing, both in volume and in content quality.
Stuart Foster
· 5 months ago
What if I just yell at you really loudly? Will that work?
I'm guessing yes...
Alexander Irving
· 5 months ago
A thousand times Yes. I also concur with Dr. Mani's comment when he said, "Your message will resonate with a tiny fraction of your audience. But I'm willing to bet that, if we took a poll in 2015, that tiny segment will be the ONLY one that's still around, successful and thriving."
Big marketers have always had the megaphone. Doesn't matter the medium. The differences now is that now every single person with something (anything) to sell has the same size mageaphone. We've empowered everyone. Everyone is a nuclear power.
Thanks for being one of those that lead with education so 'everyone' can begin to more easily recognize 'good guys' and 'bad guys'. It's a process. Always has been. Always will be.
erinbury
· 5 months ago
I think you had a right to say something. As someone who was a junior person at a PR agency, I was responsible for sending out e-mail pitches for numerous campaigns - and before we discovered the joy of the mail merge, many of these were impersonal, and maybe not even targeted. I've decided to take a different approach going forward - treat each person as an individual with specific spheres of influence, and pitch them accordingly. And the number 1 rule? Always make it personal. I agree with you - it's easier if you have some sort of existing relationship. If not though, what's the harm in sending a quick message introducing yourself and your company, and asking if it would be okay to send product/company announcements along in the future? That way you know up front if your message will be received well. And I also agree that it shouldn't be a junior person's role to pitch influencers - they don't have the pre-existing relationships and are more likely to anger someone.
Chris Brogan
· 5 months ago
Despite your passion for British accents, I have to say that's one of the things I like most about you, Erin. You were darned different than the typical junior person back then, and you continue that trend today. Keep being you. You're doing it right. : )
btwaxman
· 5 months ago
This is nicely put Chris. It's all about the relationship. And that is best achieved using the right medium and the right level of personalization or personalized approach. Something else to consider: Ever get one of those donation request letters in the mail that runs 3 pages long with underlines and highlights all over it? For a huge # of people they go right in the trash. But those letters still go out. Who in their right mind would spend the $ to do that? The answer: It is the right medium for a specific audience and it works. Not for most of us, but enough of us. Carefully crafted spamming, impersonal cold calling and the like exisit because they have a positive return on investment. Online, there are opportunities for this to work as well. That I personally do not pursue these avenues is not the point. Simply that with the right list, minimal effort spamming ends up producing enough return to make it worthwhile. Unfortunate but there it is. - Ben
Ohdoctah
· 5 months ago
I must say for the last year I have heard at least 10 of my friends say, "Do you follow Chris Brogan? or do you read his blog?" No was my answer. Often times it would come up because people would say you sound like Chris or I think Chris said something like that. So when I first heard that I thought ok don't read it one you can't learn anything you think a like. But mostly because I don't want to fall into the trap of speaking with someone else s voice.
So I stayed away until I saw you speak at the 140 conf. Then I saw you around busted your balls a lil bit about your hair cut...which is like mine! I never doubted you were a cool/nice guy enough of the people I trust said you were. A couple of short convos and you payin for the cab ride to GV's party and now I have to say I read and follow you. I do so with a lil shame lol I should have done so earlier and reached out to you.
I personally don't have time for BS and I try my hardest just say what I mean and mean what I say. Reading this I can see you do that. Very open very plain spoken. To sum up everything you said..Don't be a D*ck! Be respectful of others time.
Its the basics in life and it always amazes me how much people have to say it! Be nice don't be mean, share with others, care about the world you live in. Stuff we have heard since we were kids. I guess some people never learn, but at least you can say you made the effort. Nice Post!
Chris Brogan
· 5 months ago
We're like BFFs now that you sang Weezer and I ruined Eminem. I feel like we're chums. I'm glad we connected. I really like how you do what you do, mister sir. : )
Daniel Sevitt
· 5 months ago
You brush over the scalability thing as if it's nothing. I'd love you to spend some more time discussing this issue in particular.
The number of people with whom you can have the type of relationship you are advocating is finite. Let's say it's a thousand people. Heck, let's say it's 10,000. If you sell to 20/40/60% of those people, what proportion of your annual target will you cover?
If it's enough to sustain your business, fantastic.
Now, what if it's not?
Don't misunderstand me, Chris. I'm not down on Trust and Relationships, I'm just trying to understand the math.
I hope I'm not coming across as a repetitive naysayer. I'm really enjoying the dialogue.
Cheers,
Daniel @EyeView_Inc
Nate
· 5 months ago
These are all really good tips for influencing anyone. And if I ever need to influence YOU I will now know exactly what to do :-)
I agree with what you say about supposedly not having time to talk to people individually. That's a big load of crap. It is possible, and if anyone knows it's you. You do it every day. I do too, just on a much smaller scale.
Great post as usual.
greg cryns
· 5 months ago
Something tells me I would not benefit by dropping names at you? :)
Unless I was already an exceptional person of influence, like, uh Oprah? or (gulp) Barack?
Loved this article, Chris.
GentleEditing
· 5 months ago
I am also a human being, even though I have a double-name. Perhaps software like Blue Sky Factory permits double-names, but if my Inbox is any indicator, most canned-humanity programs do not. On behalf of all the Mary Ellens, Bobby Joes, Anne Maries, Jean Pauls, Michael Johns, Barbara Jeans, Mary Lous, Mary Janes, Jo Anns, and other folk with a space in the middle of their first name (that's right, one name, two words), let me suggest that you lobby your local software vendor and stop using auto-personalizing software. I for one am really, really tired of being addressed by half of my name. I for one am highly unlikely to do anything other than delete messages from folk who obviously don't have any relationship with me. Folk who know me use my name...not just half of it.
Jared O'Toole
· 5 months ago
Be brief! thats my favorite. I want to know the point of this right off the bat. Even if your cold selling me being brief I bet you will have my attention for a short period then I'm gone.
Andy Storch
· 5 months ago
Thank you for this post Chris. My partners and I are getting ready to pitch our new website to some blogs we'd like to partner with and I think your advice will help us a lot. People love hearing their names and reading things that are relevant to them. Thanks for the important reminder.
-Andy
Scott Gould
· 5 months ago
Chris you're fun - not many would post "a post for penance" :-)
dragonblogger
· 5 months ago
Excellent article and useful for advertisers.
olgs
· 5 months ago
having gone backpacking right after college and missed the coming of social media in my generation, I have only recently learned of you, mr. chris brogan. i decided to google you since i heard how wonderful you are. and the wonders are true. it takes so much courage to say how you like things for yourself in the offline world (hence, so many empowerment books) that to do so in the online world where you are much more transparent commands a great deal of respect. what a great lesson for me and my generation. its funny to me being my age and realizing that while the modes of communication have changed tremendously, the manner and genuineness of the communication is still necessitated. at the end of the day, we are just people trying to speak with other people. thank you for reminding us that!
All Comments
What a relief,
Steve
Elmore, VT
Hope you don't mind a trackback.
Donagh McSweeney,
Loopthing
Appreciate your social media insights. It's a fun new world.
Thanks for the feedback. You know, it *might* be that I'm heading up your way again in the fall. Was talking to Steve Wright over at Jay Peak about it.
It's an educational opportunity, and/or maybe we'll just get a chance to say howdy do.
Thanks for the update about Elmore. : )
--Chris...
http://is.gd/1xRAt
Why-(especially my last ΒΆ), I agree with Chris' frustration in post 1
This was my MO forever. It still is- to a degree.
I offer a taste of feedback that someone with
a desire for deeper understanding will recognize.
But- it is nearly always a waste of precious time.
Irretrievable time.
I put it out there, those who care can come to me.
Reality:
If someone is willing to buy a list and spam on the fly with a
half-assed blast, they are very unlikely to heed wise counsel.
Sure, everyone needs a job on the way up,
and one action may not define the person.
But people who want to operate with integrity and vision are usually
lucid, quality individuals who will not put their name on garbage.
The real problem:
That unsolicited email (with or without typos),
screams "We're willing to interrupt you out of nowhere for
OUR benefit. What's best for you couldn't mean less!!"
As always, TY!
Judy Rey
On Twitter: @judyrey
First, kudos for writing such a quick and info-led reply (I wasn't expecting anything until tomorrow!!) :)
My initial comment wasn't meant to chide (or sound like it) - I was more trying to gauge one view over the other (the email's constructiveness over the post's criticism).
I agree that crappy pitches will always be crappy pitches, and some just go off the scale with fill on crapola levels. Some you ignore, some you try and deal with. As you mentioned when chatting on Twitter (and on Seth Simonds's blog post), it's not worth the personal effort to educate/help the one as opposed to the many, hence the post.
I still think Seth makes a good point on his post, but I can also see why the time factor involved (if you did it with everyone) would be too consuming.
I think it can be a mix of both. Sometimes, it's worth that little bit of time to reach out to the emailer in question (unless it's so typically a mass mailer) and ask them a bit about their approach and offer a little guidance about you being a match for their needs. If they don't listen then, that could be an opportunity to share lessons learned (or not) with others?
The funny thing is, the two separate posts now combined show both how not to pitch and an almost best practice for any company pitching the "new world" of influential bloggers to test products or services.
Still wondering when/if SoBe will get involved.... ;-)
Thanks for this post, Chris.
Is it 'wasteful' of time to do things this way? Maybe. If you think a farmer 'wastes' seeds by planting so many, when only a few will grow. But then, if the alternative is to plant only a handful, or worse, pick the cheapest seeds (of poorer quality) just because of a promise of 'quick yield', then you'd end up with a lot of wasteland - the way so many 'shot-gun' marketers are headed!
Your message will resonate with a tiny fraction of your audience. But I'm willing to bet that, if we took a poll in 2015, that tiny segment will be the ONLY one that's still around, successful and thriving.
All success
Dr.Mani
Great comment here. As a disciple of relationship marketing, having the know-how and ability to articulate the complex relationship to the simple conversion is key.
As I talk with CEO's, CMO's and many senior leadership teams on strategy, one thing is clearly missing in their thought process - relationship. Many have not figured out a way to tie sentiment, behavior and profiles to their current valuable customers and make that connection.
The sooner Marketers understand this concept (and many will painfully get it by doing nothing) the sooner we can all have a stronger user experience.
It seems like [insert first name here] emails have already gone the way of the dodo insofar as effectiveness goes.
Thanks for the quick response, both to Danny's question and my follow-up post. You're a role model for real-time interaction.
On the other hand... maybe this wasn't the smartest thing to do? Now we'll all know how to create and send a perfect, customized, "according-to-Brogan" pitch. Would you have the heart to turn one down? :)
Marja Ernst
PS. Chris, I really love the fact admit and emphasize the fact you could be wrong. I deeply respect that in people. Kudos to you.
So yeah, I'll just be who I am and see if I can break the chain.
Also, I second the "bull." If the person you're contacting isn't worth the time, why do you think they'll feel that you are?
KLT = Know, Like and Trust.
Chris, how 'bout holding a little contest for who can come up with the best string of KLT-containing phrases or sentences? Could be fun! What do you think?
Loved your post,
Peace and Love,
DeeJay
Question: What ever happened to old school marketing?
Answer: Social Media KLT it! (as in: Social Media's KLT formula/philosophy killed it!)
Peace and Love,
DeeJay
Question: How do you recognized a social media transaction?
Answer: It'll be wearing a KLT!
OK. ... guess this is too convoluted to fly, huh?
Oh well... bttdb (back to the drawing board)!
P&L to ya, Chris,
Deejay
In the old days, this was doing your homework before the meeting. Why should online be any different? Sure, one can accomplish many more virtual interactions in the same time one could do a single 3d meeting... but shot gunning dilutes ones effort mult-ifold, and thereby lessens the probability of success, even if you try to scale it... and in time, I just don't think see that working out too well.
(I will be brief - suggestions 2)
I have said this a few times both here in other posts at http://chrisbrogan.com, so it bears saying again. Relationships, (Influence) begins with understanding your audience (Profiling) and you wont have to worry about the numbers - crowds will come.
Once you attract your audience, make sure you covet them like never before - or else, they will leave you quicker than ever (Suggestion 5).
Thanks (I said I would be brief)
Dean
I'm guessing yes...
Big marketers have always had the megaphone. Doesn't matter the medium. The differences now is that now every single person with something (anything) to sell has the same size mageaphone. We've empowered everyone. Everyone is a nuclear power.
Thanks for being one of those that lead with education so 'everyone' can begin to more easily recognize 'good guys' and 'bad guys'. It's a process. Always has been. Always will be.
So I stayed away until I saw you speak at the 140 conf. Then I saw you around busted your balls a lil bit about your hair cut...which is like mine! I never doubted you were a cool/nice guy enough of the people I trust said you were. A couple of short convos and you payin for the cab ride to GV's party and now I have to say I read and follow you. I do so with a lil shame lol I should have done so earlier and reached out to you.
I personally don't have time for BS and I try my hardest just say what I mean and mean what I say. Reading this I can see you do that. Very open very plain spoken. To sum up everything you said..Don't be a D*ck! Be respectful of others time.
Its the basics in life and it always amazes me how much people have to say it! Be nice don't be mean, share with others, care about the world you live in. Stuff we have heard since we were kids. I guess some people never learn, but at least you can say you made the effort. Nice Post!
The number of people with whom you can have the type of relationship you are advocating is finite. Let's say it's a thousand people. Heck, let's say it's 10,000. If you sell to 20/40/60% of those people, what proportion of your annual target will you cover?
If it's enough to sustain your business, fantastic.
Now, what if it's not?
Don't misunderstand me, Chris. I'm not down on Trust and Relationships, I'm just trying to understand the math.
I hope I'm not coming across as a repetitive naysayer. I'm really enjoying the dialogue.
Cheers,
Daniel
@EyeView_Inc
I agree with what you say about supposedly not having time to talk to people individually. That's a big load of crap. It is possible, and if anyone knows it's you. You do it every day. I do too, just on a much smaller scale.
Great post as usual.
Unless I was already an exceptional person of influence, like, uh Oprah? or (gulp) Barack?
Loved this article, Chris.
-Andy